Turning Pain into Purpose, Life After Sexual Assault - Part 1

Due to the nature of this podcast, please know the content may be difficult to hear and can be triggering to those listening. Please take all necessary precautions and care while listening to this podcast.

Access the transcript for this episode.

In this episode, Blaze Bell shares her story of sexual assault. She and Christina Love both deliver intimate details regarding their experiences with health care providers and law enforcement officers when seeking services after trauma.

Guest Bio:
Christina Love is an Alaska Native from Egegik village who was raised in Chitina, Alaska. She is a consultant, Recovery Coach and civil and human rights activist, while dedicating the last 7 years to systems change for targeted and marginalized populations in Alaska. She is a formerly incarcerated person in long term recovery who currently works as a Specialist for the Alaska Network on Domestic Violence and Sexual Assault (ANDVSA), the state’s coalition of domestic and sexual violence programs. Christina's role focuses on intersectionality with an emphasis on trauma and substance use at ANDVSA. Christina works with programs, agencies, and communities state and nationwide to address the continuum of care for support services through strategic initiatives, substance use screening, training and technical assistance, community-based organization, integrated services, curriculum development, evaluation, assessment, and organizational and community healing. Christina is part of a collective movement that works to end violence, oppression, shame, and stigma through the liberation of education and community healing.

Interviewer Bio:
Blaze Bell is a lifelong Alaskan, Speaker, Singer, and Transformational Coach, who has turned her pain into her purpose. She is on a mission to help others heal, in the ways that she has, from trauma and addiction. Blaze has a popular podcast highlighting healing tools and a new video series interviewing leaders in the healing industry. She is the Board President of Victims for Justice and also frequently works with Standing Together Against Rape (STAR), a rape crisis intervention service in Anchorage, Alaska. As a certified holistic health coach and award-winning singer, Blaze combines her unique skill set to bring the world healing through mindfulness, health, music, and joy.

Helpful Links and Resources:
Indigenous Sexual Assault and Abuse Clearinghouse (ISAAC) - www.isaaconline.org

This project was supported by Grant No.2019-SA-AX-K001 awarded by the Office on Violence Against Women, U.S. Department of Justice. The opinions, findings, conclusions, and  recommendations expressed in this presentation are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the views of the Department of Justice, Office on Violence Against Women or the International Association of Forensic Nurses.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

Hello. And welcome to today's episode. This podcast is brought to you by IAFN's ISAAC project funded by the office on violence against women, the international association of forensic nurses, as the recognized authority on forensic nursing, promoting universal access to care for patients impacted by violence and trauma, the Indigenous Sexual Assault and Abuse Clearinghouse project has a mission to offer technical assistance, training and education to providers serving sexual assault survivors in tribal communities. I am your host Blaze Bell, a lifelong Alaskan dedicated to helping fellow survivors heal from trauma. Today's guest is Christina Love. She is an Alaska native woman from Chitina. She is a consultant, a recovery coach, and a human and civil rights activist. Christina is dedicated to systems change and healing centered care through her work with the Alaska Network on Domestic Violence and Sexual Assault. This episode is part one with Christina. She bravely shares her story of surviving abuse, homelessness, and addiction. She then shares how she escaped that heart wrenching life began her healing journey and turned her her pain into her purpose. Now let's dive in. Hello.

Speaker 2: 1:27

Thank you so much for watching and listening today. I am Blaze Bell, and I am here with Christina Love. I'm so grateful that you have agreed to show up and share your experience with us. So, first of all, thank you. I know that talking about sexual assault is a very vulnerable thing to do, so I'm really, really grateful. And I just honor you in that. So thanks for being here.

Speaker 3: 1:56

Quyana, Gunalchéesh. Thank you so much. I'm, I'm very, very honored and grateful to be here.

Speaker 2: 2:00

So I think that a lot of people want to know what the process is like after an assault. So, you know, I feel like sometimes we hear about a sexual assault in the news and it's very sensationalized. Um, but we don't get a lot of information post, you know, it's like, well, what happened to that girl? What happened to know what happened to the perpetrator? You know, there's no follow up. And I think that a lot of us who go through these really crisis tough situations, don't always know what our options are. We don't know what to do next. And there can be a lot of fear, like, do we call the police or should we not? If we, what does that look like? How can I be protected? You know, all of these things that come up and, um, unfortunately as you, and I know we we're both victims and then it's just such a rampant problem. And so unfortunately there are a lot of people listening to this that are part of that, that statistic that we're all under. And, you know, so times like this, where we can share openly and be vulnerable and share our experience, I just think are so valuable. I just wanna open up to you wherever would like to start for us, I think will just be really, really helpful.

Speaker 3: 3:23

Yeah. I think that, um, it's such a great question. And, um, and, and thank you to the people that are asking it, you know, I know I recognize that that question is born from, you know, curiosity and then also from experience, like what, you know, what does the reality look if you, for survivors who have had this experience and, um, you know, I think that, and, and the, the answer really is, uh, within people's and what their interactions with systems are like, as well as, you know, what their gender is and what their race is or what their social economic status is, or maybe even their religion and ethnicity. You know, those are all parts that, um, can't be pulled apart, you know, from the experience and, and makeup, really, um, a lot of, um, you know, the previous and, uh, and, and the after effects. And, um, so my, uh, my first experience with sexual assault was as a child and, uh, by family members and, um, by other children. And then also by people that I didn't know, and that is, and that's, that's a really common experience within rural Alaska. Well, with, with, with the entire state, you know, we know that from statistics that EV every single woman in the United States has a 50 chance of being physically abused, sexually abused, or both, and for Alaskan native people that increases dramatically when reports show that 85% of, uh, of all Alaskan native, uh, people have been physically sexually abused or, or both. And so that's even, and that's, you know, then that plays into the history and coming from long lines, um, on both sides of my family, you know, experiencing physical or sexual abuse. Um, but when my, my sister, my older sister, I was in middle school when she made the decision to wear a wire and, um, talk to my father about the, the abuse that my family's reaction and the community's action was to not believe her. And so that was like, my first experience was like, don't tell people, because they're not gonna believe you, you know, don't, don't bring on all this drama. Don't, don't, you know, and I remember, um, uh, you know, listening to her and, you know, and at the time, um, all of my sisters were really struggling with alcohol and, you know, missing school, they were seen as, you know, troubled children that people shouldn't believe. And you, that played a huge part, you know, later on, in, in high school, drinking at a party, you know, sexually assaulted. And it was like, don't tell, don't tell people, because they're not gonna believe you, or they're gonna blame you for it. And, you know, later as, uh, as an adult, um, I ended up using drugs and alcohol, um, to cope with the, uh, the, the abuse that I survived as, as a child, you know, like a lot of people finding relief in it. We have tons of science that shows that is, um, as, as well as, you know, uh, Patrick S's recreation of the adverse childhood experiences here in Alaska shows that almost 70% of survivors who have been physically or sexually abused turn to substances. So it's like, and then within shelters, we, we know that 90% of people accessing services for domestic violences and sexual assault use substances as a way of coping you, you know, so it's like, there it is. It's, it's, it's part of, you know, the experience. It's not an other thing. We just, we know that it's very, very, very common. So then when I found myself, um, using substances and over time lost the ability to maintain housing and, um, was experiencing homelessness and, um, using IV drugs. And I had, um, allowed somebody else to make up a shot for me. And I thought that I was doing methamphetamine and heroin, and it turns out that it was bath salts, and I had never done bath salts before. And it, so it was a mixed shot that I lost consciousness and in a full up house and gang raped. And, um, by multiple people, I don't know how many days that I was out. And, um, and then they discarded me on the side of the road. I woke up, I was covered in blood. I think that, yeah, this is definitely one of'em. Haven't talked about a lot in this detail, but it's important because of, you know, where I was at that time in my life and the, and this wasn't, you know, I had, there have been other times that I'd been sexually assaulted, um, by acquaintances, they were, they were friends of mine, um, or it was a partner of mine. Um, but this one because of the severity think is really important to talk about. And it was a common thing, you know, we had, we, it was it's, it was part of the code of, you know, using drugs that if you were to, you know, overdose, then, then they would leave you so that you, so that no one would, you know, be in trouble. And, um, which was, you know, huge later on and as an adult signing Senate bill 23, you know, and, and allowing people to having those, um, access to lifesaving measures without punitive action was really, really important, um, for me as an adult to, to be there and witness that, and to be a part of that because of experiences like that. Um, so I had, um, I, at the time I was in a really violent relationship and when I told my partner what had happened, um, then he blamed me for it and, um, and, and caused more harm to me. And by the time that I had ended up in the ER, it had been, I was severely, um, um, addicted to heroin and alcohol. And by the time that I had ended up in the ER, I was, I was going through withdrawals and I was telling the nurse of what had happened. And they had, uh, brought in a police officer and I was explaining and, um, and I'll never forget, uh, what they told me. And, uh, they essentially blamed me for the sexual assault. You know, that if I hadn't been in the flop house, that, that wouldn't have happened if I hadn't been addicted that wouldn't have happened. And I told them that I was suicidal and that I wanted to end my own. And I remember, uh, they, they brought me into the, the psych ward and, um, they were doing evaluations on me and the doctor came in and he said that they were gonna release me that they didn't think that I was really suicidal. They, they said that if I wasn't on drugs, then I wouldn't be trying to kill myself, like in no, like everything was overshadowed that like the sexual assault didn't matter to everybody else. The primary was that I was addicted. And that was the, that was, and I, I remember when, when I started to go into withdrawals and I threw up on the floor, the nurse threw a towel at me and told me to clean it up myself and I, it could have way to follow through. I knew the people that did it, I know their names like to this day, like if I saw them, I could tell you who it was. Um, but I just, I left because of what I was experiencing, like the humiliation, the demoralization was, was so much worse. Like we, we hadn't even begun to talk about, um, you know, the, the physical experiences that I was having, you know, and I was worried, you know, that I might have an STD or that I might have HIV, like, but we didn't do any of those things. And there wasn't any follow up. And, um, we hadn't gotten even, um, we, we didn't even get to finishing the sexual assault kit, you know, when I wanted to just leave, like I ju I felt like everybody, the way that they looked at me, the way that they talked to me and, you know, for survivors immediately after sexual assault, um, it is, it's one of the worst experiences that you could possibly have in your life. You feel like, you know, when we do safety planning for domestic violence, it's about your physical safety, you know, how you can stay safe from this person. And when we salt is because you, you don't feel safe in your own body and you can't escape, you know, it doesn't matter how much you shower or clean yourself or what you wear. You, you can't, I, I remember, I, I couldn't look at myself in the mirror. I didn't recognize who I was. And I, you know, I, and all I could think of was I, I need to go back and get high. Like, I can't feel this, I cannot experience this at all. And so that, um, those feelings of, of providers and how providers had treated me stuck with me for a long time, you know, fast forward, um, to, um, seeking services and, um, finally meeting a physician's assistant in Fairbank, who was the very first person to give me education about addiction. And, um, you know, and by that time I had, um, severely like deteriorated, like mentally, physically, you know, spiritually, like was just an absolute shell of myself. I had been homeless for almost a decade. And I, at that time, I, I don't know how many times I had, by the time I came into recovery, how many times I had tried to take my own life or, you know, was physically abused or sexually abused. And, um, and, and he was the very first person that told me that I wasn't a bad person for using drugs. And, and he told me that way, wow. Like the first time in a long time that somebody humanized, um, services, you know, that I didn't feel bad, that I felt welcome there. And they did whatever it took to get me to where I needed to be like, and this was so important because all of these, like, myths about, um, addiction like that, you have to want it. I never wanted it, but, um, but, um, they were able to get me Vivitrol because it was 30 days, you know, waiting to get into treatment, um, which allowed my brain to heal. And even though I didn't ever, I could never imagine completely living without drugs after a certain period of time, I started to think differently. Um, even though at that time, like I was still selling drugs and I was stripping the time, you know, and I just wasn't doing drugs like, and I, and I knew that I needed, um, to go to treatment. I had a warrant out for my arrest. I was looking at like another, like three to five years had already been incarcerated in and outta jail, you know, many, many times. And so, um, when I came to, I came to, uh, to Juno in the that's, how I ended up living here on the a and Taquan of the Lincoln nation. I'm so grateful for, um, was, uh, because I came to, to rainforest. And when I got out of recovery, um, I was, I still carried all this resentment, you know, about those experiences that I just explained. And, um, I went to the local providers here and I came to the door and I said, hi, my name is Christina, and I'm in recovery. And, um, at the time I was still homeless. Um, I just knew that I couldn't return to Fairbank or Anchorage or any of the places that I had experienced at harm or had been homeless and made the choice to stay here. And, um, I, I explained, you know, that, of the resentments that I was struggling through and that I really wanted to be free of that. So I said, I will scrub your floor and I will take out the trash and I will do whatever I need to do. Um, but I'm really mad at all of you.<laugh>. And, um, and the, the person who answered the door, um, her name is Rachel Brown and she's a children's counselor, but at the time she was pregnant and didn't wanna expose her baby and utero, you know, to counseling. And so she was the volunteer coordinator. So she just happened to answer the door and was the like perfect come into my office. And she started to counsel me and I didn't really recognize it at the time. We would spend about an hour together talking and hanging out, and then I would go and do volunteer work. And, um, that went on for, um, about eight months. And then, you know, I was, during that time, I was able to, um, secure housing. I remember going to like the food banks and getting clothes like this bag of clothes that like fit really nice and perfect. And like all these, like, like things were happening. And, um, and I was connected to the community and to recovery supports and to peer supports that helped me get public assistance. And, you know, all these things that I never had access to. And most importantly, that I was like surrounded by other people who had experienced trauma and was like, you know, you're gonna be okay. And this is totally normal to not know how to feel and to feel everything and to feel angry and not have regulation and, um, and access to the science about it, to really normalize those things. So I felt like I was really unthaw. And, um, and about that time, Rachel, you should come and work here. And so I, I worked at, uh, my first job at the aware shelter, which is a local domestic violence and sexual assault program, um, was working the midnight shift. And I worked the midnight shift for many years. And then slowly over the years, um, worked my way into, um, a lot of different positions management. I did, um, a lot of resource sharing that felt like it was one of the most important, um, and for a long time, I still felt, um, more connected to the participants. And, you know, I felt like I had more in common with the participants and people who were experiencing homelessness and were still addicted to drugs. And, um, I was aware would say, um, I grew them and they grew me, like, it was so incredible to have access to education and resources and most importantly community and for the opportunity, um, it felt like I had received so much over the years. And then now is that like true reciprocity was the ability to like give back and, you know, be in, in community with everyone. And so I got to learn about, um, about the forensic side, you know, the, the entire process. And I got to use my experience to, um, hold another survivor's hand

Speaker 2: 17:36

Let's, let's pause there for a minute. That is so beautiful. And I can see we're moving into a new phase of Christina. So before we go forward, I'd love to just reflect for a minute on everything you've shared so far. Thank you so much. I I'm sure that was a lot to open up about, and I'm so grateful that you're doing that because first of all, like I was very shocked by the 85% of all Alaska natives. Did you covering any abuse or sexual abuse, specifically

Speaker 3: 18:15

Physical sexual and, or both? So it's like it's one or the other, and that, yeah, that's from, uh, the department of justice. Okay. That's, that's the government's own statistics,

Speaker 2: 18:26

So you're being a voice for them right now. And I think that is absolutely incredible and clearly, really needed clearly some big changes need to be made. And a lot of that starts with people sharing, like you just did. And with all I could think about was shame like this spiral and cycle shame that happens. And as you said, it's so common for, um, victims of abuse to turn to substances for coping. I did the same thing after my, um, abuse. I did the exact same thing. I didn't have any other skills in my back pocket at that time. And, and then it again, and just turns into this cycle. And, you know, when you're talking about the people that were supposed to be there as your heroes and your helpers and your supporters were throwing stuff at you and not respecting you and making it feel like it was your fault. And that's just so heartbreaking and also like such a reality for so many P people, whether they've been through that, or they're in fear of going through that. And so again, thank you for sharing that. And I just think it's, it's really important, whether this is a survivor listening or a care provider listening, like you needed to be treated like a human and, and you, and I now know a lot of providers and a lot of police officers and, you know, all of these people, and we know that they're, they are also human. They also have their good and bad days. And the vast majority of them want to help people. I believe that. Um, but I also know that when someone goes through an experience like yours, that's probably really hard to believe. So. Whew. So thank you. Now, I would like to ask though, how did you get through that shame? Like how did you break through, and maybe that's, that's where you're at now with finally having a supportive community and P people there.

Speaker 3: 20:33

Yeah. That's a really, really good question. Like, and I think that it is, um, for me, it was understanding that the harm that happened to me was through relationships and it was through those same relationships that, that I was able to see like the organization. I mean, the other thing about like police officers too, is because I already had that history, um, of, uh, of contact with, um, the criminal justice system, you know, like I, my very first arrest was for, you know, I was, um, bar 18 and I had, um, it was a, a traffic violation. I got pulled over. I didn't have my insurance on me, or I didn't have insurance. I don't quite, I don't really remember what had happened and I never followed up with it, completely forgot about it. And, um, they showed up at my house with a warrant and I was in, I had just gotten outta the shower. I heard some banging and I came upstairs and I was in my towel. And, um, I, then I, I, I couldn't imagine what they were there for. I wasn't, I still wasn't thinking they were there to arrest me. I thought, oh, then maybe they're here to give me a summons to court. Or I don't know. I hadn't really had any contact with them at that point. And I said, one second, let me put some clothes on. And I, um, and then I went back downstairs and the other officer was at the other door and saw me walk back downstairs and kicked the door down and then came downstairs and tackled me. And, uh, and it ended up with me being tased. I was covered in like baby oil and completely like freaked out cuz I had that history of trauma. So there were people that were seeing me naked and they were people that were touching me, you know? And, um, yeah, and then they ended up taking, they allowed me to get dressed in front of them. Um, I wasn't allowed to leave their site and I, you know, went raw or underwear and I had to go to jail and a t-shirt and pants and like no socks and shoes. And so that was like my very first contact with law enforcement. And, and then you can imagine like at the time, I mean, I was struggling with alcohol, but I wasn't really in drugs and, you know, and the less, um, social status that I carried, the worse it got, you know, the, the more addicted I was and, you know, and, and the other part, um, my, my family's from a gig I grew up in Chi and my experiences, you know, I, I remember very young recognizing that race and gender would play a part in my life and, and knew that, and, um, that oppression, you know, of being an Alaska native person, when, when the only story that you see and you don't know the whole picture, you know, then, um, I, I tell people that these are things that I was, that I caught. They were not things that I was taught, you know, and what I saw was a lot of Alaska native people struggling with alcohol and a lot of Alaska native people struggling with homelessness or losing their children, but not understanding the history behind that and why. And so then when I found myself there homeless and Anchorage, um, asking people for money that I would use for alcohol or drugs, like that was so deep, like feeling that, like I, I had this moment where I just re like, I am who they say I am, you know, like I have become the thing that I never wanted to become. And, and earlier on, it was easy to, you know, blend in and, um, and, and, and people wouldn't really notice that I was, but there I am outside exposed to the weather, you know, and, um, you know, my skin was a lot darker and, and, and then I'm dirty and all these, you know, then, um, there, there was no way of like hiding it. And, and then the internalized of that, the feeling, um, of all these different things to, to, to try and overcome, um, and, um, overcoming that, shake it. Um, it really started with people, um, like empowerment to me means that you, um, intrinsically believe in a human being's worth and their ability to overcome that's, that's like self sovereignty and empowerment together. So whether or not you believe it, then I'm gonna sit here and I'm gonna hold up a mirror, and I'm gonna reflect to you that I know that you can do this and that you were born to do this and that you have everything inside of you to overcome whether or not they believe that or not. It's my job to hold the hope for them until they can hold it for themselves. And that's exactly what, like, I don't believe you're a bad person. I believe that you're a person who struggled a lot and turned to drugs. And, and here's the science of it. Even if you don't believe me, like, here's the science of trauma, here's the science of addiction. And, um, and then other people, like just voicing things along the way. Like, I hadn't worked in a long time and they really took a chance on me and just saying like, I don't, I don't think I can do this. And they're like, I do, I wouldn't have, you know, I wouldn't have asked you to do it if I didn't think that you could. And beyond that, like, I it's, it's not even that. I think that you can, I think that you were born to do this, like, this is what you're, this is what you're gonna do, and you're gonna do it so incredibly great that, um, you know, that, that people are going to want to be around you. I wanna be around you, you know, like I'm like, wow, really? And they're like, yeah. You know, um, and then with other peers and, um, seeing other people, you know, do things that I hadn't seen, people like me, you know, people, Alaskan native people, um, women, you know, um, who had survived trauma, people who, with mental health issues, people with addiction, um, you know, there was a, there was a couple of things along the way that I can pinpoint that that was a huge like growth moment. Um, and watching the anonymous people, which is a, it's a really incredibly, um, incredible documentary about, um, people using their experience to change the narrative about mass incarceration and how, you know, people can use their experience and, um, learn to, um, change public policy. You know, the very first time I ever shared my story, um, was for a bill. Like, I don't even remember, like, I just remember coming outta detox and thinking like, people need to know how we're dying out here. Like, I don't think that people know that we, that there's all these services that we can't access that, you know, um, that all luxuries that people have just walking in their house takes like a whole day, like going from your kitchen to the bathroom, or, you know, all the different ways that were being abused or discarded or diagnosed and thrown away. And, um, and that was, you know, sharing my story was another really powerful way of like reclaiming the narrative and, and breaking that shame to say, you know, I'm not embarrassed about the things that people say. I remember this one time I ran into somebody from, um, like high school. That was that they said, uh, wow, you know, you look really great. And I was like, thanks. And they were like, I heard all these things about you. I heard that you were like homeless and you were addicted and they'd been to jail. And I was like, yeah, that's all true.<laugh> and, you know, so much more. But it though, I was like, terrified that people would find those things, but I didn't just like, reclaim that, like, yeah, that was a part of my story, but it's not something that I'm ashamed of.

Speaker 2: 27:53

Yeah. Well, and I, I think that's so important and I was just thinking that about you, first of all, I'm so glad that you got clean and that you chose to continue you healing. Because I think that someone who has the experiences you have is infinitely more adept to help other people that are going through that. I mean, and I don't know if we talked about this before, but I know one of the things that was hard for me was throughout, um, when I went to rehab and, and I had a counselor who, you know, had never struggled with addiction. And so the whole thing was just, oh yeah, well, I read about you in this book. So let's talk about that. And, you know, I'm like, but I don't like this. You don't, you don't know me, you know, and it was just, it was really tough for me to feel understood and, and almost to respect what they had to say. Um, obviously I was in a more angsty mode anyway. So, um, but that, and then when I discovered, you know, recovery groups where everyone there has the same brain, everyone there has gone through so much and overcome so much, um, that was completely different experience. And, you know, you're able to offer that. And I think that's, that's incredible. And I also, you know, I just met you a month ago or whatever. So to me, and I was even talking about, and I'm like, I met the most amazing woman and she's super powerful and, you know, and, um, I had no idea that that was your past. And so I think you're going to help give so much hope, not only to people who are struggling, but also maybe to these care providers as well to go, you know what, I, maybe they're dealing with someone who was you 20 years ago, 15 years ago, whatever. And they're not thinking that that person can become, you know, get to the place that you're at today, where you are classy and you're articulate, and you're well educated and you're really, really powerful. And I just think that's so amazing, amazing to see and to, and to believe,

Speaker 3: 30:03

Oh yeah, no, it was, I mean, like you, you dream about those kind of things. Like I remember I, I ended up getting kicked out. I've been to, um, inpatient treatment six times and I've been kicked out of every single one of'em including the last one. And, um, you know, which is a, like, I, I met my daughter's father there and we were in a relationship and I also had a lot of behavioral things that stemmed from trauma and from being homeless for so many years, like any type of authority person, you know, standing over me would cause an emotional response that at the time I didn't have any control over, you know, I mean, all this sudden I would just be like in a rage, like, and I would just be like, don't touch me, like get away from me, you know? And those are the kind of things that, that you get written up for. And if you have more than three, um, or if you smoke a cigarette, you know, then you, they kick you out, like all these different, there's all these rules that, you know, people don't really know about. I mean, and so then you have this like, dream, like I'm gonna tell them. And, but then like when it actually actually came like that, I had an opportunity to go back and provide education to every one of the hospitals, every one of the treatment providers and every one of the shelters that, um, that asked me to leave or, um, or perpetuated what's known as systemic abuse, um, and provide training, but it was, but it wasn't what I had imagined. It would be because by the time that I came back, um, I was different and, and we cried together and we grieved it and, oh, it was like some of my, like most favorite moments, like where is us like sitting in community. And then listening to me say the ways that, that they caused harm and how that made me feel and towel that made me want to end my life, you know? And, um, and then us hugging each other and them telling me that they were sorry that they didn't understand, or that they had their own experiences that they hadn't worked through, or that they were also struggling with poverty or that all of these things, you know, that, um, that we as humans do, you know, and at the end, it comes down to superiority and inferiority. And when you have people who that don't have, what's, what's called natural support. So they don't have family, they don't have friends, they don't have employment, they don't have connection to, um, you know, to these agencies and to, you know, anybody that could hold them accountable. And they're also not believable. And they have of all these behavioral issues that make it easy to be like, okay, you need to leave when really they need to be there, but, uh, but they might not have the ability, you know, and after, you know, even one, um, sexual assault, um, you know, then there's, um, PTSD, but then when you compile that with domestic violence and with a lifetime, you know, that's how you get complex, PTSD and complex PTSD, you know, there's so much, you know, irregulation and emotions that it's very to have that, uh, that anger, but you know, that tho those, those, um, I would say, um, I forget, what, what is, what is the word, you know, where we get to sit in front of one another and tell our story? Like, it was, I would say that, I mean, that was another part of like healing. The shame is just like naming it and saying it. And, and then, like you said, like having other people, like knowing that I'm, that you're not alone and normalizing all of those things, like, even if it didn't happen to me, then, um, if it happened to any person, then that would be the person's response. Like just as an, just as a human being with these, um, complex emotions. Like, we're just like this nervous, this giant nervous system. That's, it's not even us, that's experiencing the world, it's our nervous system, that's experiencing it. And, you know, um, and, and so whatever's, you know, happened there. Um, but reconnecting to, um, relationships and allowing myself to trust and allowing myself, you know, to be in community, even when it's terrifying. But out of all those, like you said, my most favorite thing is that, um, you know, for are service providers that, you know, regardless of however, um, whatever their life looks like in the present moment, however long they've been homeless, however long they've been addicted, however, however much they've been, um, abused and in any way, um, every single person has the ability to recover no matter what, no matter what, and that they might come back and, and talk to you,<laugh> about services like that. What did it, what a really, really exciting thing that each person and, and that, you know, brings us to like, um, each of our work, you know, if we are encountering somebody that we believe that can't recover, then like what's happened, you know, to our heart, because it's all, all of our job to, you know, to be that person that holds up the mirror for each person. And really honestly, with everything that we have believe it.

Speaker 2: 34:54

Yeah. Well, thank you. And congratulations, I, that full circle feeling of healing where you get to actually, literally we go back to the people that were on the other side and be there to help. And, oh my gosh, like so powerful, the, the experience of sharing some of the harm that was done and crying with those people like, oh, that's, that is so major. And most people don't ever get that opportunity in their lifetime. So that's for you and for them is just, wow, that's really amazing.

Speaker 3: 35:29

So much work is, um, goes into coming out of survival because like, that's what happens, you know, whether you're experiencing homelessness or poverty, um, or, or an assault, like it throws you into the back of your brain, like the primitive part of your brain when you're not, when you don't have safety. And that can be, you know, that can be physical safety. That can be emotional safety. There's lots of different ways that you know, that when we talk about safety, um, but when you don't have have safety and when you don't have your basic needs met, um, that you, you do live in the primitive part of your brain and, and in that part of your brain, you cannot retain it's difficult. Um, and for some people they can't retain information. You know, that, just thinking about that in all the ways that that brings like cognitive impairments, like to normalize the experience of survival. So when I came out of that, I was like, I never wanna go back to that ever, never, you know, like, oh my gosh, I can, I can hold a thought and I can think straight. And, um, I had AB I was able to like so much anxiety, you know, um, after, after trauma, like I never thought that I'd be able to look people in the eye or that I could have standing behind me or, um, that I wouldn't feel like a, you know, a nervous mess, you know, with my entire life, like how often I had, how many nights I spent, you know, like crying on the floor, like feeling like I'm never gonna feel like a whole person again, you know, just, just an absolute mess. And so when I, you know, came out of that, I just thought, gosh, I never want that to, for happening again,

Speaker 2: 36:59

Thank you so much for sharing all of this today, just as we wrap up. Um, and you can think about this for a minute, but if you had a message for any survivors listening who are failing hopeless and also for any care providers that might be seeking more knowledge for the, from the service perspective, do you have any messages

Speaker 3: 37:22

For survivors that I, I would say that, um, whatever you're experiencing is completely normal, it is so incredibly important to surround yourself with information or people that validate your experience, that normalize your experience, and that acknowledge what you're going to through the, the very first person. There's so much science behind, you know, the very first person that we tell our story to, um, that we choose very carefully because that, that changes everything about how we feel about ourselves and how we feel about the experience. And, um, you know, and, and understanding that that the whole point is to just survive. It's it is it's just to survive the, um, if people want to know what the lifetime effects are of sexual assault, it's, it's a lifetime. And that doesn't mean that it has to, it doesn't rule every part of my life. It's, it's something that happened to me. And, um, and, and I am so incredibly grateful that I have this experience so that I can relate to people in a way that is meaningful, that is authentic, and that is empowering. And that re regardless of whatever is happening in your life, I 100% believe that you have the ability to overcome everything that you have survived and have everything that you're dreaming of. Absolutely. There, there isn't anything that, um, that isn't possible, especially when we surround ourselves with people who are believing in us when we lose hope in ourself. Cuz that's another thing too, having those relationships, like I now define relat ships as giving pieces of myself away, um, to other people so that they can give it back to me when I need it so that I have people there to remind me that I have the ability to navigate it, that I am strong enough that I am smart enough that I am good mom, that I am a good employee because that's, that's part of, you know, what if what trauma does is that it, it separates us from our self and um, and it, and it does feel like, you know, the healing process has been, um, to, to feel whole again and not separated and not, not scattered and um, you know, and to normalize, you know, eating or not eating and sleeping or not sleeping or cleaning or not cleaning or working and not working or, um, or drugs or not. Those are all totally normal things that I think it, it's always important to say that you're not alone, that this is happening way more than we're talking about. And, um, and that there is no wrong way to drive. And we put, you know, um, just like recovery, we put days together and we put hours together and then months and, um, and distance from it. Um, and uh, for providers, I would say that the most important thing that they can do is to listen to the people that they're serving and be brave enough to ask, um, you know, and stand back and look at how the work is being done and ask if there's anything that we can do differently, bridge that gap between what people need and what services and providers are willing to provide, because there's often a huge disconnect and that we do all of us have a lot of hidden biases about people based on gender, about race and ethnicity and age and religion and ability that we don't even know that we have. And that internal work is so incredibly important because we can only take people as far as we've gone and survivors are hypersensitive to energy immediately. We can sit in the room and we can feel it across the room, whether or not you are somebody who's gonna be for us or against us. If you're paying attention, we can tell like if you're present or not, and, and if have done that internal work, um, we can feel when somebody's heart is open, you know, not when they're thinking about dinner and that's totally normal. So, you know, give yourself a break. You don't have to be on all the time, but you can't be off all the time. And that it really does come back to kindness. I mean, I'm here today. The only reason why I am alive is because there were people that believed in my worth that believed in my value that gave me time, um, and were willing to do whatever it took. There were so many myths about what people need. I know a lot of people say you can't work harder than the person, and that's not true. Like there were times where I, it took everything that I had to get out of bed that took everything that I had or to get on the bus and navigating those services and systems like when you are experiencing homelessness, like you can't imagine like how difficult it is to just be, you know, to just, it took me 10 years before I could take a deep breath like that, where I didn't feel the whole world, you know, coming down on me. And so filling out those applications for people you're not working harder on them taking, driving them if they need to reminding them if they missed it or if they are having, you know, at the, at the heart of trauma is dysregulation. So if they're having an emotion that's really big, like giving them that education is totally normal. Like if you it's, when people lose that anger, um, that I really worry about them. They have that, you know, really, um, blank look that they've lost the ability to fight. Um, we don't want them to lose that, you know, and, and people should be mad about being sexually assaulted. We should, we should be full of rage and be angry. Um, that's, that's totally normal. And it it's part of the experience. So, you know, knowing how to work with that and not take it personally. And then when we do take it personally, you know, have compassion for ourselves. And to know that it's just, we're just a human and, um, that everything that they need, we need to, you know, that there's no separation, that it's not just about the services that are out there. It's also, you know, a lot of those providers have their own trauma, have their own mental health, have their own substance use. Everything that they're dealing with, you know, providers are also dealing with. And, um, but on top of that, a lot of them have, you know, a lot of other things that are happening. So, you know, making sure that you have the same things that you are surrounded with, people who love you and care about you and that you have lots of pathways for healing and that you are eating when you need to and sleeping when you need to. And all those human things and, you know, um, are able for all of us, you know, able to chase that narrative inside of our brain that tells us that we're not enough, you know, so that we can cultivate, um, our own sense of peace and compassion that we're bringing people into rather than meeting them in chaos. There's a big difference, you know, and that, and that takes a lot of internal work to have that space around you, that, you know, people trust you and wanna few things. Um, because, um, because we feel when, when we know when we can't, you know, so I, you know, I, if, you know, for everybody, I just, I would say that, um, that, that I know that a lot of people have said the, the, the saying that used to be that if you don't do the work, you know, then the work is your responsibility. And this, I would say that, you know, rather than there being that, that onus on, on people who have trauma, um, to shifting it, I, I would say that the work is so worth it. Thank you.

Speaker 2: 44:27

Yeah. That's thank you so much. I, I really want to echo the compassion for ourselves and the gentleness. And I found through my own journey, getting to points where I had done some healing work and then fear would come up or retraumatization a flashback out of nowhere. And then I would not only be going through that, but then be so frustrated that I wasn't, it healed that, like I thought I was over this, you know, and then that was a whole, like, just layers of just, Ugh. So I think it's helped me a lot to really shift, to trying to be gentle and just like, okay, we're having a moment. We are human. It's gonna be okay. And, and also showing compass, like you said to, to the providers and, you know, they are experiencing crisis day in and day out layered on top of each other. So of course that's, that's a big undertaking. So anyway, Christina, thank you again. I'm so grateful that you shared all of this with us today and I just truly appreciate it. Yeah. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me.

Speaker 1: 45:34

Thank you for listening to part one today. This podcast is made possible by funding from the Office on Violence Against Women. The opinions, findings, conclusions, and recommendations expressed in the presentation are those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect the views of the Department of Justice, the Office on Violence Against Women or the International Association of Forensic Nurses. If you would like to connect with an advocate after listening to this episode, please call 800-656-HOPE that's 800-656-4673. To be routed to an advocate in your area 24/7, or go to rainn.org for more info or live chat. Thanks again for listening.